Please note that there is a new forum user approval process before you can start posting. It may take up to 48 hours for your account to be approved.

Initial reaction to patch 1.4 (pre release)

iLikeCookiesQiLikeCookiesQ
LawBreakers Rep: 1,845
Posts: 190
Member
edited September 20 in Role Feedback
So we have the notes on GS

Omega's fully charged max damage decreased from 150 → 130.
Omega's base damage with no charge decreased from 85 → 70.
*NEW* Omega's damage now properly ramps up based upon charge duration.
Omega's base damage with no charge headshot multiplier increased from 1.1 → 1.5.
Omega's damage during a Warp combo increased from 45 → 70

So clearly the omega damage was dropped. Both uncharged and fully charged. So gunslinger will be weaker as a sniper.

BUT.. Look at that headshot multiplier for uncharged omega shots, and also look at the warp combo damage increase. At close range, GS is going to potentially do more damage than before. You will have to take advantage of the warp combo, and try to land some headshots. He is now more a warp combo centric close range hero. GS will still be strong in the hands of good players.

Gunslinger: long range damage--; close range damage+;

Let's check the notes on enforcer

Aerator minimum spread decreased from 0.35 → 0.
Aerator maximum spread decreased from 3.75 → 3.25.
Badger ammo per clip increased from 6 → 7.
Distortion Field's default active duration increased from 4 → 6 seconds.
Distortion Field's buff bonus to reload & weapon swap speeds has been increased from 25% → 35%.
Reduced acceleration speed while Distortion Field is active from 5000 → 2500.
*NEW* Enforcer can now use double jump even when distortion field is not active.
Fuel regeneration time decreased from 10 → 7 seconds.
Bloodhound Rocket's ammo has been reduced from 4 → 3 salvos.
Bloodhound Rocket's damage per rocket (4 per salvo) has been decreased from 40 → 38

In advance, as an enforcer/wraith main, I'm going to tell you that this makes enforcer insanely OP. The spread reduction vastly improves your medium range damage. In addition, we have 50% longer boost duration. It might also not be apparent from the notes, but I suspect that this also means 50% more energy gained off hits. (ie if fuel consumption got reduced to make the total duration 6 seconds, and not the total fuel increased instead, then you have indirectly buffed the energy gain off dealing damage, as that now gives more effective boost time per hit)

The time to regenerate came down from 10 to 7 seconds, which is a ~43% increase in passive fuel regen. This is ON TOP of the 50% longer duration. So in effect we get a 1.43*1.5 = ~2.14x faster passive regen, in addition to the 50% increased energy of dealing damage. Enforcer will be able to much more liberally spend fuel to walk faster.

(If the new duration was coded as an increase in fuel capacity, rather than a reduction of fuel consumption per second, then we do not get this 50% extra fuel from damage dealt. And the passive increase will be only ~43%, not ~2.14x) The patch notes don't tell us what they did sadly.

So his movement speed bonus was reduced. It makes sense if you have so much more energy. He is made much stronger in combat, and deserves the slower speed probably. The bloodhound nerf is really not that big of a deal, it will just set up a kill with your gun, rather than get a kill by itself. (The increase in health across the board makes them less powerful already). The reload speed buff together with the vastly larger availability of his boost will make him able to reload an aerator clip in combat, and empty another magazine.

enforcer: sustain++; medium range damage+; mobility-;


Now let's look at wraith

*NEW* Triple jump now generates one charge upon landing, and subsequent charges after a 0.5 second delay.
*NEW* 3 second cooldown on the Wasp Stab lunge
Spektor's damage per bullet increased from 24 → 25.
Spektor's minimum spread decreased from 1.0 → 0.35.
Spektor's damage falloff range decreased from 1200 → 600.
Spektor's spread amount on bullets after 3 bullets have been shot increased from 2 → 3 per bullet.
Spektor's ammo increased from 25 → 30;
Stinger's single target damage with a direct hit increased from 150 → 175.
Stinger's travel speed increased from 8000 → 9000.
Slide Kick damage increased from 25 → 75.
Slide Kick travel speed reduced from 1850 → 1700.

These aren't all buffs like the accompanying text suggests. "On the buffs train we're loading up improvements for almost every other aspect of the kit, with more damage on the Spektor, Slide Kick and Stinger, and a longer Key ability duration."

Spektor's minimum spread is reduced, but that doesn't really matter. Look at the 5th patch note: His maximum damage range got cut in half. So that means you will be dealing much less damage per bullet at medium range. At medium and long range the minimum spread matters, and at this range his damage is severely reduced. The 6th patch note means that the shots after the 3rd bullet fired per burst will generate 50% more degrees of spread. 7th note is simple: more ammo.

So regarding wraiths gun: more sustain at close range, but much less powerful at medium range. You are going to do much less damage when burst firing at people at medium range. This was the most skillful part of playing wraith. (besides finding the flank route and picking your engagement right). The slide kick got buffed to be more than just an increase in range for your knife and that is nice. Wraith now has 200 burst if he lands his slide + knife, and 270 if he also kicks after using the knife.

We don't know the dash range of the knife when it is on cooldown, and neither do we know the damage. At least they are taking wraith in a less spammy direction. I think he will still be able to flank despite the mobility nerfs. One knife use gives a lot of momentum, and bunny hops + air jumps let you maintain that momentum.

wraith: close range sustain+; medium range damage-; mobility-; close range burst+;


The passive health regen is sooooooooo welcomed. I was already requesting this after CB2 aaaand its here =D. I'm really exited for this patch actually. Let's see how OP enforcer is going to be.
MAX2

Comments

  • BKP_VidiousBKP_Vidious
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,200
    Posts: 33
    Boss Key
    Thanks for your thoughts.

    Though I need to clarify one thing for you.

    The Enfocer does not gain more fuel for successful hits/kills while firing.

    The changes to fuel only have to do with the speed it burns and regenerates. The amount you gain for shooting a player is the same as it was before.
  • iLikeCookiesQiLikeCookiesQ
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,845
    Posts: 190
    Member
    But if you burn less fuel per second, and you gain a set amount of fuel per hit, you gain increased seconds of fuel per hit. Do you mean to say that his Maximum energy capacity was increased, instead of the consumption per second reduced?
  • SmutsbultenSmutsbulten
    LawBreakers Rep: 500
    Posts: 8
    Member
    I read it as decreased burn rate and increased recharge rate while turned off. The latter does not factor in in Cookie's scenario, but the former does. With a maintained fuel per hit recharge rate and a decreased burn rate (consumed over 6 seconds as opposed to 4 today) each hit will equate to a longer increased fuel burn time post patch.
  • BKP_VidiousBKP_Vidious
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,200
    Posts: 33
    Boss Key
    • Active duration is 6 seconds. (Which means if you burn the entire meter down in one run, it takes 6 seconds). Same as saying the meter has more max fuel than before.
    • Fuel regeneration time decreased to 7 seconds. Meaning, if the entire meter were empty, it would regenerate on it's own over 7 seconds total.
    • Amount of fuel player earned when shooting an enemy is unchanged.

    I just wanted to be sure you weren't thinking that we also reward more fuel on-hit than the previous patches. It's just a fuel meter, but explaining it can be difficult. :)

    Now that does translate into more active fuel use overall if you land successful hits while burning the fuel. But that was a planned process when it was changed.

    We continue to make balance changes as we go. The Enforcer is up against higher health enemies now, so he's going to reload a ton more than he would have in the past. The fuel is tuned to help him maintain a balanced state with the changes to health in patch 1.4.

    We're keeping an eye on the situation, and none of the changes were "indirect." ;)
  • iLikeCookiesQiLikeCookiesQ
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,845
    Posts: 190
    Member
    • Active duration is 6 seconds. (Which means if you burn the entire meter down in one run, it takes 6 seconds). Same as saying the meter has more max fuel than before.

    So the patch notes that tells us the active duration becomes 6 seconds, does not tell us what way this is done. It could either mean the max fuel was increased by 50%, or it could mean that the fuel consumption while active is reduced by 33%.

    Hence the confusion, because the latter implies that you get more effective boost time from dealing damage. Good that that is cleared up not to be the case. Each shot hit still gives the same amount of boost time as before.

    Perhaps make your patch note like this: "Maximum fuel capacity increased by 50%. (full meter now lasts 6 seconds)."
    From this it is immediately clear what it does.
    SmutsbultenBKP_Vidious
  • AlexChicago04AlexChicago04
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,100
    Posts: 63
    Member
    Why the increased health? I know it's for a longer life span, but people who were good at the game didn't need that. I bet people who wanted this weren't even good at the game. Its stupid, it really kills the update. I hope this gets removed in a future patch. But good update though.
  • SpleTSpleT
    LawBreakers Rep: 660
    Posts: 47
    Member
    i like the increased health as assassin main tbh.... 300 hp was soo squichy could get instagibbed accidently in a crossfire :p
  • LlamatronLlamatron
    LawBreakers Rep: 410
    Posts: 3
    Member
    edited September 24
    Why the increased health? I know it's for a longer life span, but people who were good at the game didn't need that. I bet people who wanted this weren't even good at the game. Its stupid, it really kills the update. I hope this gets removed in a future patch. But good update though.

    It's explained in the patch notes:
    The main goal this patch is to increase average lifespans across the board, as we've found that many of our players are spending significantly more time staring at a respawn screen than we'd like.

    I don't think it's been especially requested by the community, but they have access to more data than us. Apparently they decided that people died too much and it would make the game more fun if players lived a bit longer.

    Also about the "people who were good at the game didn't need that. I bet people who wanted this weren't even good at the game". People who are not that good but want to have fun playing LB should not give feedback ? Crap mentality if you ask me.

    I don't think it especially favors less good players, but following your logic, if we want more players don't you think it would be better if new people trying the game spent more time playing than staring at the respawn counter, and have more fun during their 2 hours Steam trial ? Can't complain with low population and BK making the game a bit more noob friendly.
  • iLikeCookiesQiLikeCookiesQ
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,845
    Posts: 190
    Member
    edited September 24
    • Active duration is 6 seconds. (Which means if you burn the entire meter down in one run, it takes 6 seconds). Same as saying the meter has more max fuel than before.

    So the patch notes that tells us the active duration becomes 6 seconds, does not tell us what way this is done. It could either mean the max fuel was increased by 50%, or it could mean that the fuel consumption while active is reduced by 33%.

    Hence the confusion, because the latter implies that you get more effective boost time from dealing damage. Good that that is cleared up not to be the case. Each shot hit still gives the same amount of boost time as before.

    Perhaps make your patch note like this: "Maximum fuel capacity increased by 50%. (full meter now lasts 6 seconds)."
    From this it is immediately clear what it does.

    So I tested it and you DO in fact gain more boost time off hits. Look at these two videos. Video A is from before 1.4. Notice I only have 400 max enforcer health. Video B is from after 1.4. Notice the 500 enforcer health.

    Video A:


    Video B:


    Now compare section 0:00 - 0:05 from video A to section 0:00 - 0:05 from video B. You see a that in video B you can outgain your energy loss while boosting. In video A this is not the case. Now compare 0:37 - 0:42 from video A to section 0:05 - end in video B. You see that the same amount of meter length is gained from those two shots. (It is not as clear as the previous example, but I think it is the same.)

    From this I conclude the following:
    1. Energy gains per hit were unchanged.
    2. Maximum energy is unchanged.
    3. Energy used per second while boosting was reduced by 1/3rd (33%).
    4. Passive energy regen while not boosting was multiplied by 10/7ths. (This achieves the 7 second time for meter to regen to full from empty)

    This means that 1 shot hit worth of energy (the same amount of energy as before), gives you 50% more active boost duration as before, because you can boost longer with the same energy ( 1/(1-0.33) = 1.5)

    Maybe I understood some of the dev comments wrong?
    SmutsbultenBKP_Vidious
  • BKP_VidiousBKP_Vidious
    LawBreakers Rep: 1,200
    Posts: 33
    Boss Key
    edited September 26
    I agree that there may be a more clear way to describe the changes.

    But I'll try to break it down as clearly as possible. I understand the need to get accurate info about this sort of thing!

    The meter was tuned from a perspective of percent fuel used per second.
    • Max fuel amount is unchanged
    • Fuel reward on hit is unchanged
    • Rate of spending fuel (speed it burns) is slower
    • Rate of regenerating fuel naturally (speed it recovers) is faster

    Let me know if more clarification is needed!